5e Mistakes: Spells and Classes

Comments · 289

• KO

  @koticneutralftw7016 · 8 days ago

  Hi, player, GM, and arm-chair designer here. I really appreciate you looking back at the older design choices with hindsight and a critical eye.

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• TO

  @Tolkienfan72 · 7 days ago

  As a long-time DM this series of retrospectives has been really validating. I've had to work around basically every issue you've talked about, and I've always wondered if I was just playing the game 'wrong' in some fundamental way. I'm glad it's not just me.

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• AN

  @AngelusSperi · 7 days ago

  I mean... fwiw 4e successfully did that: wizard spells were more AoE and damaging and had more movement/control debuffs while cleric prayers we focused on supporting allies (hit, damage, AC/defenses, saving throws, and on) and their few - weaker - AoEs wouldn't hurt allies. They felt super different (even the implement cleric compared with the implement wizard). Heck, Sorceror and Wizard felt totally different and the old Fighter vs Ranger issue played differently as well. Nothing's perfect, but those designs did a lot right.

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• IA

  @IamtheTolle · 7 days ago

  5e warlock invocations were so great, and also drove me crazy. That design space could have applied to each class so well (having customization option features like rogue tricks, natures secrets for druids, oaths for Paladins). Warlocks have so much more customization

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• TH

  @TheLyricalCleric · 7 days ago

  I loved the design of the 5e warlock, it was so different than any of the other casters I had played before. Other people pushed me to make a pact of the blade warlock for damage dealing, but I loved the pact of the tome and the fact that I could cast any ritual spell if I found one with the Book of Ancient Secrets invocation. I decided my character was chosen by the Great Old Ones and all his spells were lovecraftian flavored, and I even made my own grimoire book of shadows to write down all my character traits and spells in. But here’s the kicker—I kept the notes as if I were a doctor talking about a mental patient, because my character actually WAS originally taking care of a pact warlock and was driven mad by what he heard. So now he is constantly seeking out the truth about this abominable force that he has learned too much about, but he doesn’t realize that he’s the patient he’s trying to cure. Loved playing him, loved reaching into others’ minds to speak to them because it would creep others out to know that there were unseen tentacles writhing around inside their heads every time I used the ability.

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• WH

  @Whutintarnation · 7 days ago

  What you are talking about is niche protection, and 5e flushed that down the toilet.

  6

• GA

  @Gaiawolf · 8 days ago

  The blurring of the boundaries between classes has not been a positive for 5e/5.5e. Still enjoy the game though. <br>Thanks Mike for sharing your thoughts. Always appreciated. 🖖

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• RO

  @RodneyMadness · 6 days ago

  Good to hear discussion of the game from an actual design perspective rather than a discussion of session/campaign content.

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• TH

  @theonlyotherclone · 7 days ago

  brainstorming my own game my main obsession has been strong character identity so like you said with invocations if you have classes the more mechanically distinct the classes are the better

  4

• DY

  @dylanhentch9719 · 2 days ago (edited)

  <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmRv4XvDF6M&amp;t=666">11:06</a> and we&apos;re back to the the 3.5e Warlock huh?<br><br>Shout out to Richard Baker for nailing it on the first try.

  1

• KE

  @kevinsmith9899 · 8 days ago (edited)

  Wizardry completely consumed my life for about 4 days. Skipped school (college). Only left the room to eat or use the bathroom. Barely slept. It was amazing.

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• UN

  @unservant · 7 days ago

  “Subtle mistake” 😅😂<br><br>We did no playtesting or designing and it caused problems

  4